student expelled from UVAWise

[R0cketer]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess the same message you'd be sending by expelling a student for a piece of creative writing. If they want to sanction him for the guns, OK. If they want to expel him over writing it's not OK. I highly doubt you know the guy...so all you are doing is assuming he's deranged, which isn't the case. He went to war for your right to run your mouth, and you want him to be punished for his right to bear arms. Won't you just go suit up and head to Iraq to defend your own rights. </div></div>

Being a veteran doesn't give someone complete freedom, or more than others. It also doesn't mean that a person is stable, I've known quite a few people who served who were more unstable than about anybody else I know. Fine and dandy to respect service, but that's not a get out of jail free card either.

[R0cketer]

Now to the rest of the issues. If the college hadn't reacted, be it overly or not, and something would have happened, how many lawsuits would good lawyers have had? So this guy may have a case, what about the 20 that might have a case if he did do something? It's a no-win situation really. I doubt that the story in of itself was the complete trigger, who's word are we taking on that? The guy? Hey I know people who got caught speeding and have 200 reasons why it wasn't really appropriate, or they didn't really do anything. Let's not completely believe the hype. I'd dare say someone in the class knew the guy enough and decided to say something, alerting people to the guns, instead of waiting till the day that the guns showed up in their classroom. It's funny to me that the solution seems to be 'let everybody have a gun' and that will fix it, and isn't that what the wild west used to be, and places had to have people turn in their firearms to get in there? We have the right to have arms, that doesn't give you absolute freedom. Just like you have freedom of speech, doesn't mean you can go into a theater and scream fire. It would be great if we said well common sense prevails but unfortunately a lot of people lack common sense and only can see things that suit them.

I appreciate that things used to be different, kids could carry pocket knives, guys had gun racks in their vehicles (although its funny, you hear people talk about that time, not many people had vehicles for their kids to drive to school), I also understand that people left their doors unlocked to their houses, people helped people out, etc. Now the person next door is probably an addict who would sooner club you in the head than help you.

By all means, protect yourself. Have 20 guns in your house, one under your pillow, etc. If you are permitted to carry a weapon, carry it everywhere you can legally. Legally being the key word. If you don't like that the colleges or schools take an alternate approach, that is fine too. I don't like the speed limit is sometimes 35. If I don't choose to follow that, I face the consequences. Just realize that you will as well.

[centennialdawg]

I have sat here and watched this topic grow and grow and grow into what a person's rights are on campus. I don't know how it is on the campus at UVA-Wise, but on most campuses, there are signs and warnings posted throughout that anyone, including their personal items, be it pocket books, bags, or even cars are subject to search. It is a public area, the same as the court house in Wise or the White House in Washington. Remember the locker searches and car searches in high school? The same applies to the campus at UVA-Wise. In the student manual, I believe it even states that weapons are not allowed on campus.

Like Rock said, times have changed. I am a veteran of 2 conflicts and one war and that does not give me any more rights than any one else. It shouldn't give him any more rights either. I believe it was purely stupid on his part to believe that would give him any more rights than others.

As far as him being unstable, that is not for us to establish, but it is for the authorities to prove.

Finally, I do believe that the professor did act prematurely. I don't think I have read anywhere that he talked to the person in question about his paper. To me, he should have done that. Then, if he still had concerns, let the student know and then tell the authorities. Maybe, just maybe, this whole situation could have been avoided if the professor had done that.

This whole incident kinda makes me wonder how many weapons would be confiscated and how many people would be charged with a crime if a "blanket" search were done on the campus.

[gcdevil22]

here's my 2 cents for whatever it is worth on the subject...

IMO UVa-Wise probably acted a little strict in regards to the story itself, I think it could have been handled better with the professor, student and an advisor beforehand

however, if a school has a law that does not allow weapons on campus, however right or wrong that rule is, it is still a rule that everyone must abide by and it is something you agree to when applying for undergrad status at wise...he broke that rule, they have a set consequence for breaking such rule and that action was taken

now, as far as "letting every legal person who can carry guns" goes, i said before when our shootings went on last year that i have been around many many many altercations in which people (who could get a licensed weapon very easily) got heated and if there had been a firearm nearby, there would have been many lives taken...so instead of having one incident where 32 lives are lost in a period of 50 years, there would be 2 or 3 every month, even if you "prevented" the 32 by carrying a weapon

arguing otherwise is just silly, but something i would expect from our area

[centennialdawg]

You just made my point. As I said, he broke the rule and just because he is a vet, doesn't give him the right to break the rule.

[R0cketer]

I will also agree that from the surface, it looks like things could have possibly been dealt with a bit differently. That being said, there is no way of knowing that maybe someone else didn't report it, or a concern. I know in the crazy world we live in, if someone concerned me with their writing or behavior, I'd be trying to get someone to check into it.

[CoeburnCane]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: centennialdawg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You just made my point. As I said, he broke the rule and just because he is a vet, doesn't give him the right to break the rule. </div></div>

Yeah--that's one argument that's been made in this thread that I definitely don't agree with. I respect vets, but being one doesn't give you carte blanche.

[CoeburnCane]

WISE "? Steven Daniel Barber, 23, says a culture of fear has displaced rational thought.

The Iraq War veteran's comments came Tuesday, shortly after learning his expulsion from the University of Virginia's College at Wise had been upheld. He has been prohibited from attending classes since Feb. 29 "? the day after sharing a story in which a character contemplates murdering his professor, then turns to thoughts of suicide.

Barber wrote the piece for his creative writing class.

"It's the nanny state run amok "? political correctness to the extreme,"? said Barber in a phone interview. "Nobody goes after Stephen King. Nobody goes after William Shakespeare. This is a whole new low."?

Calls to the UVa-Wise Office of College Relations for comment were not returned Tuesday afternoon. Chancellor David. J. Prior heard an appeal of the expulsion Monday night. Barber said he was contacted Tuesday morning by Prior's secretary, informing him the expulsion had been upheld.

"I am surprised,"? Barber said. "Chancellor Prior is a reasonable man, and if anyone was going to give me a fair hearing it would have been him. It's a case where the culture of fear has displaced rational thought."?

After Barber submitted the creative writing story, officials searched his dorm room for the weapon his fictional character kept under a pillow. Though no weapons were found there, Barber told campus police he had three handguns in his car, and a concealed weapons permit for each.

Campus officials then required Barber to undergo a series of mental heath evaluations. Campus police escorted Barber to a Frontier Health facility in Big Stone Gap. On Monday, Campus Safety Chief Steve McCoy said Barber was "involuntarily transported"? for medical evaluation. That temporary detainment is "similar"? to involuntary commitment, "as far as a police officer is concerned."?

With his appeal now lost, Barber says he will seek a civil suit against UVa-Wise to have his expulsion reversed. He may also explore compensation for financial damages.

"Because I'm expelled I'm immediately going to have to start paying back on my student loans,"? Barber said. "The only way I can pay for it is if I go back into the military. The plan now is to re-enlist and start a lawsuit."?

"I took an oath to protect and defend the Constitution, and now I'm getting in trouble for expressing my rights,"? the veteran added.

For Barber, a return to the military had always been an option "? after he graduated from college. That way he could serve as an officer.

"I never anticipated having to go back in as enlisted,"? he said in discouraged tones. "But if that's the best way to generate some money so I can pay back my loans, that's what I'm going to do."?

Barber reports the chancellor's secretary provided no explanation of why the expulsion was upheld. He says his creative writing class had previously read a story in which a girl murdered her boyfriend. His piece centered on a student contemplating the killing of a professor "? with no violent action actually taken.

"He doesn't do anything other than drinking and drug use and writing,"? Barber said of his character. "There is no violence. But yet, everybody assumes that the character is the writer, which couldn't be further from the truth."?

Barber is confident a court of law will allow him to be reinstated at UVa-Wise. He also admits the experience could hinder his dreams of eventually entering law school.

And, despite his battle with "political correctness to the extreme,"? the Southwest Virginia native remains loyal to UVa-Wise, his school of choice.

"I have a lot of pride in the school. I love the professors there,"? he said. "I only put in an application to one school, and that was Wise. That's where I wanted to go, and where I want to go now."?

----------------------------

Guess that part in bold puts to rest the "involuntary committal" argument we all had.

Also note the 2nd bolded part--told all ya'll he wasn't the author. Someone got it right by asking the question directly to him this time, it looks like.

I did laugh however when he used some massive hyperbole, comparing his story to the writings of Stephen King & Bill Shakespeare. That's hilarious.

[imported_Sportsman]

Here's another article.....looks like there was previous trouble at school with this young man.



UVa-Wise Student Who Wrote Fictional Threat Of His Teacher Is Expelled

Thursday, Mar 13, 2008 - 12:50 AM

By Michael Owens
Staff Writer
Bristol Herald Courier


The fiction writings of expelled college student Steve Barber have raised red flags with teachers before ? a high school essay once earned him a session with a concerned guidance counselor.

"They wanted to make sure I wasn't depressed or something," the 23-year-old said in a telephone interview Wednesday.

The University of Virginia's College at Wise, which last week expelled Barber, made the expulsion permanent on Tuesday.

On Wednesday, the Herald Courier might have learned why: Not only was there the previous high school essay, but Barber has a recent conviction for being drunk in public and also was charged with assault and trying to break into another student's room. The latter charges were dismissed.

Barber, a former U.S. Navy sailor from Scott County, Va., landed in a mental-health ward Feb. 29 for three days of observation after penning a story for his creative-writing class about a suicidal student bent on killing his college professor.

In Barber's case, his actual professor shares a name with the fictional teacher and is a son of U.S. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia.

UVa-Wise tasked its campus police with investigating Barber's fictional reference to guns and the Virginia Tech massacre. Officers reported finding two loaded handguns in Barber's car, which was parked in a school lot. Officers found a third, unloaded pistol in the trunk.

The Herald Courier wrote about Barber's expulsion in Tuesday's edition, but he never mentioned his criminal background. On Wednesday, the paper learned he was serving a year-long school probation for public drunkenness, stemming from a September incident.

Barber also failed to mention in previous interviews the high school English paper that once alarmed teachers.

"I don't really remember too much about it. I remember it was humorous," he said when pressed Wednesday. The topic of that essay remains unclear.

Barber also acknowledged being on probation at the university through September because of an alcohol-related incident in his dorm last year.

Based on Barber's version of events, it was Sept. 18 when police confronted him for trying to break into a dorm room that he mistook for his own while admittedly in a drunken stupor.

He did community service for the misdemeanor drunk-in-public charge and was ordered to keep out of trouble for the next year while on campus, he acknowledged.

"I got in trouble before, but that was separate from this [the Feb. 29] incident," Barber said.

The college refused to discuss his status Wednesday beyond saying he no longer was a student at UVa-Wise. Efforts to reach professor Christopher Scalia have been unsuccessful.

"It looks like I'm going to get my lawyer ... and sue the school," Barber said.

He continues to argue his innocence, noting Scalia's class was fiction writing.

As for the guns in his car, a school official said in a previous interview that Barber broke only the university's weapons ban, but did not violate any state laws.

Barber, who had a concealed weapons permit until it was revoked last week, says the school overstepped its bounds.

"I was following the law and they were not ... and I'm maintaining that the school's ban on firearms is illegal," he said Wednesday.

Gun proponents argue that Virginia has yet to pass a law allowing colleges and universities to ban concealed weapons, and so a permit trumps any school regulations.

Barber contends he stored the handguns in his car because he couldn't keep them in his campus dorm room.

At the time, Barber had a Virginia-issued concealed-weapons permit that allowed him to carry the handguns, court records show. A judge revoked the permit last week based on Barber's "involuntary" commitment for mental observation. School officials had successfully filed for the temporary detention order that landed him in the ward.

Barber said he will try to win back his concealed-weapons permit, too.

[email protected] (276) 645-2549

[pvfan]

Yet, some on here will still defend him. Some people just believe everything they hear, the college can't comment on this due to privacy laws. So, the only story you hear is Barbers and people eat it up like candy.